Does one "need" to install Windows on a hard drive partition in a MacIntel laptop (MacBook Pro)?

Can some flavor of Windows XP SP2 be installed on an external drive? I'm interested in running Windows programs (probably interpreters, like MatLab, and compilers), and an occasional, retrogressive Internet Explorer website that proves too inscrutable for Safari.

If it is possible to install a bootable version of Windows on an external drive so that Bootcamp, VMWare, or Parallels can access Windows? The drive doesn't necessarily need to be a hard drive - it could be a flash drive or SSD.

I realize this is doing things the hard way, but I have my reasons.

Thanks.

I have successfully created virtual versions of Windows and Linux OSes using Parallels or Sun Microsystem's VirtualBox and moved them off the internal hard drive to an external drive. They work fine. I think I first saw this being done by
Terry White and/or Jack Beckman.
My first generation MacBook Model Identifier: MacBook1,1
Processor Name: Intel Core Duo
Processor Speed: 1.83 GHz
Number Of Processors: 1
Total Number Of Cores: 2
L2 Cache (per processor): 2 MB
Memory: 2 GB

isn't too happy to be running too many things when I do that but it works.

Buried in a subsection on THIS Apple website I found the following:

"You can use Boot Camp to install Windows on any internal hard drive, but not on an external hard drive."

If you are building a virtual machine - with Parallels, VMWare Fusion, or VirtualBox - then the VM can reside anywhere. It's just a file. You may be very disappointed in the performance if you install to a flash drive, as they are much slower than regular drives.

You cannot boot from Windows installed to an external drive via Boot Camp. The install process will work just fine, but come boot time you will not be able to successfully boot to Windows.

Well, the new problem child, my Gateway gaming computer, came with Vista which annoys me but I'm wondering if I can just wipe it off the hard drive and start over with a fresh OSX install. My iMac doesn't perform nearly as well with, say, Warcraft as the Gateway does so perhaps OSX on a gaming computer would be the best of both worlds.

As I am sure someone will tell you here, it is a violation of Apple's EULA to put their OS(es) on anything other than a Mac. Maybe this will save them the trouble.

quote:

it is a violation of Apple's EULA to put their OS(es) on anything other than a Mac.

Maybe so... but I'd like to see Apple try and take anyone to court for installing their legally purchased software onto their legally owned machine. I seriously doubt Apple would get very far. Even if they did, it would be bad press for Apple to appear as the Software installation bullies! The X86 project has been going for years now. Even though Apple made them take certain information down off the site, I've yet to hear about Apple suing anyone for installing OS X on a WinTel box.

quote:

I'd like to see Apple try and take anyone to court for installing their legally purchased software onto their legally owned machine.

Like Psystar?

Point is, we can't help with stuff like that here - don't want to get MacGroup into legal trouble.

There is Apple and there is this MacGroup forum here whose President is a software exec with Adobe.

The story I tell myself is to go elsewhere if you want to make a Hackintosh cause it won't be
supported here.

quote:

Like Psystar?

Psystar was a computer system reseller which made them a direct competitor with Apple. I'm talking about individual end users. If apple has broken down any doors of homeowners and hauled them to court for trying to install OS X on their WinTel box, I've yet to hear of it.

quote:

There is Apple and there is this MacGroup forum here whose President is a software exec with Adobe.

And your point is what??

quote:

...if you want to make a Hackintosh ... it won't be supported here.

No one ever said it would be and I don't remember anyone asking for help on the matter. KC was just stating that he was kicking the idea around and that he *might* want to try it. Are the thought police out in force today??

quote:

Originally posted by Jack Beckman:

quote:

I'd like to see Apple try and take anyone to court for installing their legally purchased software onto their legally owned machine.

Like Psystar?

Point is, we can't help with stuff like that here - don't want to get MacGroup into legal trouble.

Ah yes, well in order to both fulfill your virtuous service to Apple along with the Macgroup website and to actually be helpful in the process, you can say something more along the lines of the following:

Technically it is possible to install OS X on a Wintel computer however it is frowned upon by Apple so I wouldn't recommend it. You have to essentially perform a hack of the OS and modify the BIOS to get it to work and since Apple wouldn't support it, you're pretty much on your own so do it at your own risk.

I had to do some research at other websites to find that out.

quote:

I had to do some research at other websites to find that out.

Exactly my point!! LOL!!
No one here is advocating breaking Apple's EULA! First off, let me state that I think it's mostly an exercise in futility. If you research all the rigmarole that you have to go through in order to get it to work, for most users (even computer building hobbyists) you're better off just getting an iMac anyway.

Although, if we can't even discuss the fact that it's possible to install OS X on other hardware for fear of reprisal, sorry Apple, but the days of me ever purchasing from you again would be over.

If someone really wants to run OS X from a wintel box... go right ahead!

This system will never run at 100% and when you attempt to run gaming software you might hit 60% at best. I know a few folks who have tried this and everyone admits that while it it possible to make it happen, you end up with an unreliable system.

Legalities of software vs. hardware aside... this is like putting lipstick on a pig. Lot of effort with less than desired results. You still end up with a pig...

quote:

Originally posted by Paul:

quote:

I had to do some research at other websites to find that out.

Exactly my point!! LOL!!
No one here is advocating breaking Apple's EULA! First off, let me state that I think it's mostly an exercise in futility. If you research all the rigmarole that you have to go through in order to get it to work, for most users (even computer building hobbyists) you're better off just getting an iMac anyway.

Although, if we can't even discuss the fact that it's possible to install OS X on other hardware for fear of reprisal, sorry Apple, but the days of me ever purchasing from you again would be over.

We're on the same wavelength here. It's helpful to state the answer politely and not assume that the reader knows everything that you know. Being rude doesn't serve Apple or the Macgroup website. My question, as you correctly interpreted it, was more academic than anything. Actually, I was at the store yesterday ogling the 24 inch iMac and wondering if I could turn that in to the gaming computer even though as Wintel boxes go, my gaming computer is really good despite Vista. Hopefully, Windows 7 will make up for it.

Wow. I didn't realize anyone was being "rude" here. I thought we were having a discussion - at least until I was accused of being a member of the "thought police" and now "rude".

quote:

Wow. I didn't realize anyone was being "rude" here.

I agree Jack.. I don't think you were being rude, and my comments about the "thought police" were aimed more at Kirk than you. Mostly for his statement about Apple, Macgroup and Adobe.

I just didn't agree how you and Kirk immediately stated that "We can't help you with that" when (as far as I can see) KC never asked anyone for any help. He was simply stating that he was *thinking* about it. And I do agree with you about Psystar as Apple was correct in going after them. I said previously, I was speaking about individual end users, not companies that sell computers.

quote:

Originally posted by Jack Beckman:
Wow. I didn't realize anyone was being "rude" here. I thought we were having a discussion - at least until I was accused of being a member of the "thought police" and now "rude".

Well, you weren't really having a discussion, you just said, rather curtly, that you couldn't help. If you want to have a discussion, respond the way my example does. Discussions are exchanges of ideas not "we can't help you". If you're going to assume the mantle of keeper of Apple's and MacGroup's interests, diplomacy isn't a bad idea, yes? Be rude and people just think you're no different than Microsoft.

The comment I often get from colleagues and friends about a Mac is that it's more expensive than Dell. A lot of people always go with what's the cheapest. I just accept that. Do I say 'well then I can't help you' or 'well don't buy it then'? No, I tell them that it's been more cost effective over the long run to buy a Mac because I never have problems and it's just a better product. I also, when able, show them online that the MacBook isn't really that much more expensive than a comparable Wintel laptop.

quote:

Legalities of software vs. hardware aside... this is like putting lipstick on a pig. Lot of effort with less than desired results. You still end up with a pig...

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What is the desired results you are looking for when you apply lipstick on a pig?
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Quote from the back of Sam Drucker's store from Eb the hand at the Douglas's Farm.

" Come on Arnold, I told you we should have used Coty instead of Max Factor "

--- The women on the iBBS will get this ---

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Calvin,

Jack Beckman said, "Point is, we can't help with stuff like that here - don't want to get MacGroup into legal trouble."

KC said, "…you just said, rather curtly, that you couldn't help."

The above dialog excerpt points out a fundamental of behavior in bulletin boards:

Read carefully and thoughtfully. Put the best possible construction on the actions/words of others. Do not read anything that is not explicitly written. Especially, do not take offense at what is not written.

As a mild correction to KC, Jack did not say that he couldn't help. He merely pointed out that we could not help you in this venue. And he is correct. For example, I could answer all kinds of Windows questions here, but it would be inappropriate to do so. So I try to only mention Windows when there is a problem common to Mac OS and Windows. I refer most Windows questions to other forums, usually via Google-found leads.

A second guideline for bulletin boards is to try to keep on topic where possible. Chuck M asked, "Does one "need" to install Windows on a hard drive partition in a MacIntel laptop (MacBook Pro)?" The answer is Yes for Boot Camp and No for VM instances. Now here we are discussing etiquette regarding Hackintosh. We have gotten far afield of the topic. It is probably a good time to end this thread unless there is some expansion of the answer for Chuck M's question.

Thank you all for your participation and patience.

Thanks everyone for helping me.

Sometime soon, hopefully after I find a job, I'll need a new laptop. Some of the stuff I want/need to run is MatLab and LabView. As odd as it may seem, neither Company could tell me if the Mac version of their software runs as well as the PC version. To be on the safe side, it makes sense to install their WinTel version.

While there haven't been any destructive viruses invented yet for Windows, it is certainly possible and very feasible. I really don't want Windows to toast my partitioned hard drive in a MacIntel laptop.

Interestingly enough, one of my friends loaded the wrong nVidia driver while he was re-platforming a WinTel machine, and it overclocked his graphics chip so much that it shut down the computer from overheating it. There are some other safety concerns about Windows partitions I have, so I figure the safest approach is to physically separate OS X and Windows on different drives.

quote:

Read carefully and thoughtfully ... He merely pointed out that we could not help you in this venue.

Yes, I agree - Read CARFEFULLY. So I'll post this for the *third* time. KC NEVER ASKED ANYONE TO HELP HIM!!

And I'm sorry - but this paranoid believe that Apple will be calling Terry to shut this board down just because someone mentioned in passing that they might try to install OS X on their Dell is silly and ridiculous as best!

It may be worthy to note that about a year and 1/2 or 2 years ago, Either PC World or MacWorld (don't remember which) ran a full article on "How to Install OS X on your Home built PC" and even listed what components to buy. If Apple sued them or even complained about the article in any way, I've yet to hear of it!

You'd better run and hide KC!!! If the government can find people that know the truth about the "FAKE" Apollo moon landings, I'm sure Apple can find you too!